In a message dated 8/18/2009 2:01:48 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it writes:      As an outside casual observer to this group discussion, it seems to me that the crux of this argument stems from the notion of free will and whether or not we have it, or are products of our environmental and genetic conditions, or other drivers. As H. L. Mencken once said, For every complex question there is a simple answer, and it's wrong. The concept of free will must be tempered with the genetic and environmental factors that constrain or enhance it. For example, whether or not you are likely to drink milk and enjoy ice cream is in part dependent on one gene in your body - the gene allele for lactose tolerance. If you are lactose intolerant (the normal mammalian form of the allele) drinking milk or foods with a large amount of lactose will tend cause nausea and make you feel ill. If you have the mutation of the allele (as I do) you are likely to enjoy milk and milk products. Everyone has free will to consume lactose foods or not; however, some will feel sick if they do. In the case of nicotine, numerous studies have documented that early exposure to the substance increases the likelihood of physiological addiction. A recent study from Utah found a gene allele, that if present, increases the probability of addiction given initiation of smoking before age 16. However, if the youth begins smoking after the age of 17, the allele appears to have no effect on risk for addiction. Other studies have indicated that whether or not one begins to use a given mood altering substance or not is largely determined by environmental factors. However, having begun to use the substance, the risk of addiction is largely determined by genetic factors. The issue is not whether or not free will is at play with respect to mood altering substances but to understand the influences and predispositions for initiation of use, misuse, and addiction. At this point, in the neighborhood of 90 gene allele variations have been  identified that influence responses to a range of substances. Philosophy is well and good for many topics, but in this area hard science is the superior route to understanding, extending knowledge, developing clinical strategies, and formulating rational public policies. Norm Norman G. Hoffmann, Ph.D. Adjunct Professor of Psychology Western Carolina University Tel: 828-454-9960 www.evinceassessment.com ############################################################# This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to   the mailing list < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it Send postings to < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it To unsubscribe, E-mail to: < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it Send administrative queries to  < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it CSAT assumes no responsibility for the opinions and information posted by users. #############################################

Time, This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it writes:    As an outside casual observer to this group discussion, it seems to me that the crux of this argument stems from the notion of free will and whether or not we have it, or are products of our environmental and genetic conditions, or other drivers. As H. L. Mencken once said, For every complex question there is a simple answer, and it's wrong. The concept of free will must be tempered with the genetic and environmental factors that constrain or enhance it. For example, whether or not you are likely to drink milk and enjoy ice cream is in part dependent on one gene in your body - the gene allele for lactose tolerance. If you are lactose intolerant (the normal mammalian form of the allele) drinking milk or foods with a large amount of lactose will tend cause nausea and make you feel ill. If you have the mutation of the allele (as I do) you are likely to enjoy milk and milk products. Everyone has free will to consume lactose foods or not; however, some will feel sick if they do. In the case of nicotine, numerous studies have documented that early exposure to the substance increases the likelihood of physiological addiction. A recent study from Utah found a gene allele, that if present, increases the probability of addiction given initiation of smoking before age 16. However, if the youth begins smoking after the age of 17, the allele appears to have no effect on risk for addiction. Other studies have indicated that whether or not one begins to use a given mood altering substance or not is largely determined by environmental factors. However, having begun to use the substance, the risk of addiction is largely determined by genetic factors. The issue is not whether or not free will is at play with respect to mood altering substances but to understand the influences and predispositions for initiation of use, misuse, and addiction. At this point, in the neighborhood of 90 gene allele variations have been  identified that influence responses to a range of substances. Philosophy is well and good for many topics, but in this area hard science is the superior route to understanding, extending knowledge, developing clinical strategies, and formulating rational public policies. Norm Norman G. Hoffmann, Ph.D. Adjunct Professor of Psychology Western Carolina University Tel: 828-454-9960 www.evinceassessment.com ############################################################# This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to the mailing list < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it Send postings to < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it To unsubscribe, E-mail to: < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it Send administrative queries to  < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it CSAT assumes no responsibility for the opinions and information   posted by users. ############################################# ############################################################# This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to   the mailing list < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it Send postings to < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it To unsubscribe, E-mail to: < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it Send administrative queries to  < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it CSAT assumes no responsibility for the opinions and information posted by users. #############################################

Is there room for one more? Don Gene _expression_ Addiction is not a disease (?) perm_link_ Category: Cognitive Science • Culture • Health Posted on: August 16, 2009 7:07 PM, by Razib Khan Recently I listened to the author of Addiction: A Disorder of Choice, Gene M. Heyman, interviewed on the Tom Ashbrook show. A lot of the discussion revolved around the term disease , which I can't really comment on, but a great deal of Heyman's thesis is grounded in rather conventional behavior genetic insights. In short, a behavioral trait can have a host of inputs, and is often a combination of environment & genes developing over a lifetime. Alcoholism is not much of an issue among observant Mormons because of their environment, not their genes. Heyman points out that whereas some behavioral phenotypes, such as schizophrenia or autism, are extremely difficult or impossible to cure through one's own personal choice (i.e., for schizophrenia you may need medication, while many autistics are what they are no matter the drug or environment), addiction therapy can work and so change the _expression_ of the trait. Additionally he makes some important criticisms of the methodologies of clinical studies of addiction which seem important to me, primarily that there is a strong selection bias in these samples which overstates the inability to control impulse in individuals prone to addiction (similar problems probably resulted in an overestimate of the concordance for homosexuality among twins). But the bigger issue is the same as the one that crops up with obesity, what role does personal responsibility and public policy play? Many of the critics of Heyman seem to be suggesting that he is reverting to blaming someone with an illness. The fat acceptance movement makes similar arguments. These issues, and the fact that policy and culture revolve around them, mean that we have to begin to rethink our conceptions of free will, choice and decision making. It isn't about people being good, bad, irresponsible or moral, it is people being who they are, and confronting the cards they're dealt.

In a message dated 8/19/2009 11:25:47 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it writes:      Here's the issue for me, if a human never consumes alcohol (any substance) or never began a process that person can not be misusing nor dependent as they never drank; ....the genetic predisposition for alcoholism could be there; does the gene get turned ON for the process of a disease/disorder or the aspect of freewill for choosing not to begin to consume alcohol. The genetic predisposition can be there and dormant without the addition of the substance. However, once the substance in question is ingested, the effects of the genetics manifest. The generation skip sometimes seen with alcohol in some families is the situation where the children of an alcohol dependent individual chose not to ever drink due to the experience with their parents. However, their children may develop dependence because they carry the genetic predisposition, but do not have the motivation to never begin drinking. Celiac disease (severe reaction to gluten) would be another example of a disorder with a genetic predisposition. If the person in question never ate bread or other foods containing gluten, they would never manifest the disease. Delaying onset of gluten consumption in infants is now part of a study to determine if avoiding early exposure in infants with the gene for the disease will either reduce the severity or prevent the disease entirely. In the case of alcohol, nicotine, and other drugs, we have seen that early exposure to the substance is related to higher risks for addiction. In the case of nicotine, the risks are greatest for those smoking prior to the age of 17 and increase substantially if smoking begins before the age of 12 or 13. Norm Norman G. Hoffmann, Ph.D. Adjunct Professor of Psychology Western Carolina University Tel: 828-454-9960 www.evinceassessment.com ############################################################# This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to   the mailing list < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it Send postings to < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it To unsubscribe, E-mail to: < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it To switch to the DIGEST mode, E-mail to < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it Send administrative queries to  < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it CSAT assumes no responsibility for the opinions and information posted by users. #############################################

Re: In the case of alcohol, nicotine, and other drugs, we have seen that early exposure to the substance is related to higher risks for addiction. But why? I've never seen a study that's able to demonstrate that this is not due to correlation rather than causation. Are the youth who are using at that age doing so because they have underlying MH symptoms? That's my guess. Jennifer Baity Carlin, LCSW Co-Occurring Disorders Specialist San Francisco Behavioral Health Center (SFBHC) [formerly called the Mental Health Rehabilitation Facility (MHRF)] San Francisco General Hospital 887 Potrero Avenue San Francisco, CA 94110 (415) 206 6342 (415) 206 6918 fax (415) 327 4184 pager There is nothing about a caterpillar  which would suggest that it will turn into a butterfly - Buckminster  Fuller Confidentiality Notice - This e-mail transmission may contain confidential or legally privileged information that is intended only for the individual or entity named in the e-mail address.  If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution, or reliance upon the contents of this e-mail is strictly prohibited.  If you have received this e-mail transmission in error, please reply to the sender, to arrange for proper delivery, and then please delete the message from your inbox.  Thank you.              Evinceassessment@                                                          aol.com                                                                    Sent by:                                                   To              <dualdx@treatment         This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it                              .org                                                      cc                                                                    Subject              08/20/2009 09:47          [dualdx] Re: Interview with Gene M.              AM                        Heyman, author of Addiction: a                                            Disor...                                          Please respond to                                                          <dualdx@treatment                                                                .org                                                   In a message dated 8/19/2009 11:25:47 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it writes:      Here's the issue for me, if a human never consumes alcohol (any substance) or never began a process that person can not be misusing nor dependent as they never drank; ....the genetic predisposition for alcoholism could be there; does the gene get turned ON for the process of a disease/disorder or the aspect of freewill for choosing not to begin to consume alcohol. The genetic predisposition can be there and dormant without the addition of the substance. However, once the substance in question is ingested, the effects of the genetics manifest. The generation skip sometimes seen with alcohol in some families is the situation where the children of an alcohol dependent individual chose not to ever drink due to the experience with their parents. However, their children may develop dependence because they carry the genetic predisposition, but do not have the motivation to never begin drinking. Celiac disease (severe reaction to gluten) would be another example of a disorder with a genetic predisposition. If the person in question never ate bread or other foods containing gluten, they would never manifest the disease. Delaying onset of gluten consumption in infants is now part of a study to determine if avoiding early exposure in infants with the gene for the disease will either reduce the severity or prevent the disease entirely. In the case of alcohol, nicotine, and other drugs, we have seen that early exposure to the substance is related to higher risks for addiction. In the case of nicotine, the risks are greatest for those smoking prior to the age of 17 and increase substantially if smoking begins before the age of 12 or 13. Norm Norman G. Hoffmann, Ph.D. Adjunct Professor of Psychology Western Carolina University Tel: 828-454-9960 www.evinceassessment.com ############################################################# This message is sent to you because you are subscribed to   the mailing list < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it . Send postings to < This e-mail address is being protected from spam bots, you need JavaScript enabled to view it . 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HOW WOULD THIS THINKING EITHER WAY APPLY TO MULTIGENERATIONAL SOCIETIES...LIKE THE MOSLEM SOCIETIES THAT TEND NOT TO USE ALCOHOL ? DO THE GENETIC DIMINISHES OR THE FREE WILL STRENGHTENS/ OR IS ENHANCED ? - Hide quoted text -- Show quoted text -